Talk:Children of the Hash

Votes

• NW --Robyn 17:17, 9 July 2009 (UTC)
• I like the idea but oppose making this a standalone achievement. --ilpadre 06:16, 10 July 2009 (UTC)
• I also oppose this as a standalone achievement and agree with ilpadre. --Danatar 07:40, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I took the liberty to summarize the votes above from the discussion below. -- relet

• Needs work. I would probably agree to an achievement along these lines, but the proposal is still unrefined. -- relet 12:21, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

Discussion

NW - Not a bad idea. I'd like to see you make it clear how the advance site scoping out is to be documented and incorporated into the spontaneity. Do the coordinates have to be reached? Do you get the ribbon if you meet children at the hash, or only if you bring the children yourself? What if you convince people with children to come? If you travel partway to the hash with them? Draw a line clearly there. Does the geohash have to be reached with/by the children to qualify? -Robyn 17:17, 9 July 2009 (UTC)

What about getting rid of Item #2 and just putting in the standard disclaimer?

Disclaimer: When any coordinates generated by the Geohashing algorithm fall within a dangerous area, are inaccessible, or would require illegal trespass, DO NOT attempt to reach them. Please research each potential location before attempting to access it. You are expected to use proper judgment in all cases and are solely responsible for your own actions. See more guidelines.

And then another sentence like "When you bring children on an expedition, you are responsible for their safety. Some expeditions which might be suitable for adults are unsuitable for children."

I think the geohash should have to be reached with/by the children to qualify, and if it turns out to be a point that the children can't get to, then you can try again another day. The drag-along achievement can't be claimed if you don't reach the hashpoint, and this is really just a special case of drag-along achievement. Besides, requiring that the child reach the point makes it simpler to determine who qualifies for the ribbon.

I don't like achievements that automatically get you other achievements. If this is just a drag-along for dragees under twelve, then it should be a rank (see Air Geohash for an example of ranks) of the Drag-Along achievement and not its own achievement. -Robyn 06:00, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I think it should be fine to bring the children's parents/guardians, as long as you are the one who arranged for the children to be there. That is, if you ask "Would you and Junior come geohashing with us?" and then you all reach the hashpoint, the parents, the children, and the one who invited the children could all take the ribbon.

You should also perhaps be able to get the ribbon if you meet children at the hash and explain to them about geohashing and get them to step right on the hashpoint, or in some other way participate. (From when they're old enough to not eat the chalk until ... I don't know some age older than my older kid, they enjoy marking the hashpoint.) You shouldn't be able to get the ribbon just because children happened to be present at the hashpoint when you got there.

Should there be a special deluxe ribbon for achieving a geohash with kids without burning fossil fuels? Sara 03:38, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I like the idea but oppose making this a standalone achievement. If you reach the coordinates, it's, like Sara said, a special case of drag-along. If you don't reach them, take the Nanny consolation prize (we should probably work on this almost forgotten achievement to include hashpoint areas not suitable for children). I also have somewhat disquieting feelings about meeting children on the way to the hash and convincing them to come with you. A stranger approaching little kids to take photos of them and make them follow him to a seemingly random place would probably make me as a bystander call the police, and that's the kind of police hash you really don't want. Even if their parents are present, I doubt they will understand what you are doing and why you need their kids, and I can't blame them. It's one thing if you ask somebody you've never met to take a picture of you in his garden, but something totally different if you ask him to take a picture of you with his little girl. I think such an achievement could encourage some hashers to unintentionally overstep the bounds of good judgement and seriously damage the reputation of geohashing (and their criminal record). Just my two cents. --ilpadre 06:16, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

Hmm, I hadn't thought about that point, but I guess you're right. I also didn't realise how similar this was to the drag-along achievement. So unless someone has any ideas for a twist that could make this a standalone achievement, maybe it really would be better to introduce it as a rank to drag-along... Fivetonsofflax 07:15, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I also oppose this as a standalone achievement and agree with ilpadre. Bringing your own (or a friend's, with permission) kids with you on the expedition is good and should be encouraged, if the place/trip is suitable for children. But the drag-along achievement already exists (we could add a "with kids" item to the ribbon), and about the part with meeting children on the way: Mob Justice ("There's no justice like angry mob justice") is waiting at the corner, torch in one hand, rope in the other, and I'd hate to see an expedition report like "My first expedition in 8 years thanks to couch potato location, the nice warden took the picture of me with my fellow inmates during yard walk.". - Danatar 07:40, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I agree that this is better suited to a rank of the drag-along achievement, and I take back what I wrote late last night about engaging with children that you meet at the hashpoint; this morning I realized how bad it would sound in the press: "Participants get points for approaching children they don't know and convincing them to come with them." Sara 12:05, 10 July 2009 (UTC)

I like the idea, and would possibly include a condition that you have to set out on the expedition only with children you know, not dragging strangers along, for the reasons stated above. However, I still believe in people's common sense. I have no idea if you plan to work on the wording, but it definitely needs a clear definition before it can get any support. -- relet 12:21, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

"Oppose" It doesn't strike me as an achievement. LuxMundi